[Koha] Users and developers (was KUDOS - ALA Proposed Agenda)
Joann Ransom
jransom at library.org.nz
Fri Jan 22 12:03:47 NZDT 2010
Hi Lori,
My understanding is that is what Bugzilla is designed to manage. Are you
suggesting this replaces bugzilla as the official Koha enhancement and
bug database? As a user I really don't want to have to go to 2
different places, and I am sure we are all aware of the strong feelings
around forking Koha, not juist the code here but the community tools
which support the code.
Cheers Jo.
Lori Ayre wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> As some of you know I'm involved as a consultant with both Koha and
> Evergreen projects. One of the things that is being pursued by King
> County Library System as part of the IMLS grant they received is the
> development of an Enhancement Database. The RFP is going to be "on
> the street" soon. The concept is to create an online venue and set of
> tools to help people find out what others are doing with development
> and to find out what they WANT to do so they can chime in or join up
> in some way.
>
> Whatever is created could certainly be used by either project as it
> will not be Evergreen centric in any way (except possibly in the way
> that it relates to the Equinox team's development environment - since
> we're specifying that the product should be able to export specs to
> the development team once they've been accepted and funded ...or
> something).
>
> Anyway, just wanted to alert you to that. I'll post it to this list
> (if you like) as soon as it is released (the RFP that is).
>
> Lori
>
> On Thu, Jan 21, 2010 at 9:32 AM, Scott Kushner <skushner at mtpl.org
> <mailto:skushner at mtpl.org>> wrote:
>
> Owen, MJ. Et. Al.
>
> Didn't mean to start a minor controversy amongst the list. Let me
> clarify what I meant.
>
> Where I see developers and users at odds (or, a "disconnect, if you
> will), is in the Request for Code Development process.
> Right now, we are all operating like little "islands" where each
> library
> goes through a long "planning process" in which each library decides
> what features that they absolutely need to see in Koha to operate
> daily
> and meet their patron's needs. Now, much development currently needed,
> which is not yet committed, is very redundant, and what I'm trying to
> suggest is that we all don't spend (and waste) time trying to
> re-invent
> the same wheel. Also, we can't really know what others are planning
> right now for KOHA without communicating to them, before the RFC
> process.
>
> I see KUDOS as a place where libraries can meet and discuss the code
> that they are "planning" to sponsor, before submitting to Bugzilla
> (brrr..) ,or the Koha Wiki, so code development can be leveraged
> before
> being submitted, thereby making the process more stream-lined and
> efficient.
>
> Am I saying that developer's should be excluded from this process?
> Absolutely not.
>
> Am I saying that a KOHA USERS group is an excellent vehicle for the
> USERS to communicate and further leverage the planning process and
> development thereby making KOHA better. Absolutely.
>
> That is my take on the value of a "USERS" group in KOHA.
>
> If I am wrong, then, have at me....
>
>
> Scott Kushner
> Information Technologies
> Middletown Public Library
> -----Original Message-----
> From: koha-bounces at lists.katipo.co.nz
> <mailto:koha-bounces at lists.katipo.co.nz>
> [mailto:koha-bounces at lists.katipo.co.nz
> <mailto:koha-bounces at lists.katipo.co.nz>] On Behalf Of Owen Leonard
> Sent: Tuesday, January 19, 2010 7:59 PM
> To: koha at lists.katipo.co.nz <mailto:koha at lists.katipo.co.nz>
> Subject: Re: [Koha] Users and developers (was KUDOS - ALA Proposed
> Agenda)
>
> Okay, get ready for a rant...
>
> > Sometimes "users" and "developers" are at opposite poles...
>
> When? I'm a Koha user. And in using Koha I saw that I could make Koha
> better, and in time became a Koha developer. There is no Koha
> developer out there who is developing Koha features just because they
> think it would be cool to do. Koha developers are doing their work
> because they *see* a need, in an actual user or an actual library. Or
> developers are getting paid by libraries to develop the features the
> libraries need.
>
> Here's when users and developers are at opposite poles:
>
> - When a company decides to develop a feature that they think will
> help sell a product, even though the feature doesn't meet any actual
> need
> - When a company throttles or cripples a feature in a product because
> they want to charge extra for a particular feature
>
> No self-respecting Koha developer or Koha support company is doing
> that kind of stuff. That's why we're here.
>
> > I think this is more about giving the "users" more of a voice than
> they've traditionally had in
> > the past, no?
>
> I honestly don't know where this comes from. The Koha project is just
> about as open and accessible as any software project can be. You can
> participate on the mailing list, you can submit bug reports yourself,
> you can submit your own patches or hire your own programmers to write
> code for you. You can talk to Koha developers on IRC almost 24 hours a
> day!
>
> The only way in which one might consider that users need "more of a
> voice" is if you think of it in terms of working collectively to
> achieve a goal that Koha libraries individually could not. If that's
> the intention of that statement then, rant over. I agree 100% that
> libraries should be seeking ways to pool their resources ($$) to get
> done the things they want done, i.e. hire developers or commission
> existing companies to do work for them.
>
> However, if by "more of a voice" you mean, "If we all get together an
> ask for a feature the Koha developers should implement it," then no.
> This is open source, but time is money. You can donate your time (as I
> do, every day, in code, markup, email, and IRC) or you can donate your
> money--in the form of paid development work.
>
> This doesn't shut anyone out. But yes, there is a bar that you have to
> clear. I don't know how else it can work.
>
> So: Let's get together as users and/or developers and figure out how
> we can get some stuff done. Let's put together a structure by which
> Koha users can spec out new features and get them funded,
> collectively. Let's put together a structure by which Koha users can
> communicate with their vendors without fear of exclusion or reprisal.
> Let's not talk about a users group breaking down some barrier that
> isn't really there--let's talk about strengthening and leveraging the
> connection that we *already have!*
>
> -- Owen
>
> --
> Web Developer
> Athens County Public Libraries
> http://www.myacpl.org
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