General #koha IRC meeting times
How to equitably distribute meeting times for monthly #koha IRC meetings is an open question. People who have no time for formal analysis may opt to go directly to my suggestion for meeting times at the end of this message. IRC meetings with several participants are good for quick clarification of issues but the reasonable time constraints on IRC meetings make such meetings a poor venue for more careful reflection and discussion. We have the mailing lists for more careful reflection and discussion. Despite much experience considering meeting times, the issue deserves some degree of formal analysis. 1. CONTEXT. We have monthly general meetings on the #koha IRC channel which are open to everyone. They tend to last about one hour and are mostly concerned with clarifying the state of development progress in real time for various branches of Koha and other matters of administration. Sometimes, votes are taken at meetings on matters which are usually minor but occasionally important matters such as project development roles. More participation in Koha would be good even if meetings might became a little longer or require some additional time management for meetings as a consequence of more participation. Choosing one time at which all interested people distributed throughout the world could meet has always been difficult. During most of the past two years, we have made efforts to fairly distribute meeting times by alternating the hour from one meeting to the next. 2. CURRENT ISSUE. The issue of changing the meeting time by 8 hours at each successive meeting has been raised in recent meetings. I am not certain whether that was formally agreed but I question the wisdom of changing times by an arbitrary 8 hours as we do not have an arbitrary global distribution of people interested in Koha. I conducted a trivial analysis of distribution of the population in various time zones. Maybe an examination would help avoid arithmetically equal distribution of meeting times based on 24 hours where arithmetical equality with clocks might not be equality for actual people which could harm instead of help meeting participation. 3. ASSUMPTIONS. For the purpose of trivial analysis, I have taken some simple presumptions which may reflect my own personal preferences but are not uninformed by the experience of when people have and have not participated in meetings at various hours. The possibility that any particular meeting might need to address an especially important issue should discourage choosing any meeting times which would be extraordinarily difficult for most people interested in Koha to attend. I take avoiding sleep disruption by those motivated to participate to be the most important consideration. I presume that midnight to 6 AM local time are the most problematic hours for starting a meeting and 2 AM to 4 AM to be the most problematic hours within that time. I somewhat ignore issues of seasonal local time adjustments, regular commuting times, school times, etc. Please raise those issues if they present a serious problem generally. 4. SOURCES. The Interactive Time Zone Map at http://www.jgiesen.de/astro/astroJS/timezone/index.htm is helpful in showing population centres in different time zones. 5. RELATIVELY LOW POPULATION TIME ZONES. Relatively low population time zones might reasonably be given least consideration for time preference until interest in Koha is more evenly distributed globally. UTC +11 - Time Zone L - New Caledonia UTC -1 - Time Zone N - Cape Verde UTC -9 - Time Zone V - Alaska, USA UTC -10 - Time Zone W - Hawaii, USA UTC -11 - Time Zone X - American Samoa; Midway Islands UTC -12 - Time Zone Y - Marshall Islands My suggestion about meeting times at the end is intended to be fair on a global basis but is weighted towards higher population time zones than those above. 6. RANGES OF HIGH POPULATION TIME ZONES. 6.1. EASTERN HEMISPHERE HIGH POPULATION RANGE. 6.1.1. EDGES OF EASTERN HEMISPHERE HIGH POPULATION RANGE. UTC +12 - Time Zone M - New Zealand - Avoid UTC 14 -16 or better avoid UTC 12 - 18 UTC +0 - Time Zone Z - Ghana; Iceland; Morocco; Portugal; Senegal; UK - Avoid UTC 2 - 4 or better avoid UTC 0 - 6 6.1.2. OVERALL EASTERN HEMISPHERE HIGH POPULATION RANGE. Avoid UTC 14 - 23.59 and 0 - 4 or better avoid UTC 12 - 23.59 and 0 -6. 6.2. WESTERN HEMISPHERE HIGH POPULATION RANGE. 6.2.1. EDGES OF WESTERN HEMISPHERE HIGH POPULATION RANGE. Time Zone P - Argentina; Brazil; Chile; Paraguay; Uruguay - Avoid UTC 5 - 7 or better avoid UTC 3 - 9. UTC -8 - Time Zone U - British Columbia, Canada; California, Oregon, and UTC -3 - Washington, USA - Avoid UTC 10 - 12 or better avoid UTC 8 - 14. 6.2.2. OVERALL WESTERN HEMISPHERE HIGH POPULATION RANGE. Avoid UTC 5 - 12 or better avoid UTC 3 - 14. 7. LEAST PROBLEMATIC TIMES AND PAST MEETING TIMES. UTC 19 is outside the time range adverse for the western hemisphere high population time zones and the outside edges of the eastern hemisphere high population time zones. UTC 19 has frequently been used for Koha meetings. UTC 10 is best for the more populous eastern hemisphere than the less populous western hemisphere. UTC 10 has been used in alternation with UTC 19 for many Koha meetings. 8. SUGGESTION. Alternating between UTC 5, 10, and 19 with occasional adjustment for seasonal changes in local time seems to me best for encouraging diverse participation based on my trivial analysis. However, UTC 5 maybe a sufficiently poor time for western Europe and Africa that there would be no additional participation from people in western Europe and Africa at UTC 5 relative to UTC 2. If UTC 5 is a sufficiently poor choice, then perhaps the UTC 2 hour chosen for the next meeting may have no worse an effect on participation from western Europe and Africa than UTC 2 which is a better choice for the western hemisphere high population time zones. Thomas Dukleth Agogme 109 E 9th Street, 3D New York, NY 10003 USA http://www.agogme.com +1 212-674-3783
On 07/04/11 21:27, Thomas Dukleth wrote:
8. SUGGESTION. Alternating between UTC 5, 10, and 19 with occasional adjustment for seasonal changes in local time seems to me best for encouraging diverse participation based on my trivial analysis.
However, UTC 5 maybe a sufficiently poor time for western Europe and Africa that there would be no additional participation from people in western Europe and Africa at UTC 5 relative to UTC 2. If UTC 5 is a sufficiently poor choice, then perhaps the UTC 2 hour chosen for the next meeting may have no worse an effect on participation from western Europe and Africa than UTC 2 which is a better choice for the western hemisphere high population time zones.
Those choices might be good, but I think that instead of studying world koha developers distribution, would be better to define the meeting times based on participants convenience. For example, suppose you got 20 developers in France and 4 in Japan, but for the next meeting those 4 are sure to attend, while only 1 from France will come. Then we should favor a time more convenient for japaneses, without excluding french people, of course. That's over simplified, but I believe I made my point. We could ask attendees to fill a form stating a time range and also preferred times, do some math and define better suited times for most people. What do you think about that method? I believe I can make an online scheduler so people can insert their time information and we can come up better suited times. -- Fernando Canizo (a.k.a. conan) - http://conan.muriandre.com/ GCS d? s:+ a C++ P--- L++++ E--- W+++ w--- M-- PE-- !tv b+++ h---- y+++
Fernando Canizo wrote:
We could ask attendees to fill a form stating a time range and also preferred times, do some math and define better suited times for most people.
What do you think about that method?
I believe I can make an online scheduler so people can insert their time information and we can come up better suited times.
Give it a go. The list has used doodle.com in the past for this. In the absence of that, I agree with thd's suggestion (as I understand it) of alternating 10 and 19, with 5 if enough people like it. Hope that helps, -- MJ Ray (slef), member of www.software.coop, a for-more-than-profit co-op. http://koha-community.org supporter, web and LMS developer, statistician. In My Opinion Only: see http://mjr.towers.org.uk/email.html Available for hire for Koha work http://www.software.coop/products/koha
On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 7:27 AM, Thomas Dukleth <kohalist@agogme.com> wrote:
How to equitably distribute meeting times for monthly #koha IRC meetings is an open question.
People who have no time for formal analysis may opt to go directly to my suggestion for meeting times at the end of this message.
In Thailand one often hears the locals comment that we farang (Westerners) "think too much". In this case, although I completely respect the intentions, I'd have to agree 8-) IMO initiating a Doodle poll say 3 days before the date, post it here, and those that are motivated to attend can vote for the timeslots that work for them.
On 08/04/11 10:27, Thomas Dukleth wrote: (snip)
8. SUGGESTION.
Alternating between UTC 5, 10, and 19 with occasional adjustment for seasonal changes in local time seems to me best for encouraging diverse participation based on my trivial analysis. (snip)
Currently UTC 19 is 5am in Eastern Australia. But as we generally don't achieve large participation by Australians in these meetings (surprising in some ways) and it can't be 9am everywhere at once, we can live with this. The other two times work well for us. There is a rapidly expanding Koha community in India and Pakistan, which iirc are 4 to 5 hours behind us - so UTC 19 is in the wee hours there. People in that zone may wish to chip in. Good analysis, Thomas, thanks. Bob Birchall CALYX
On Sat, Apr 9, 2011 at 6:38 AM, Bob Birchall <bob@calyx.net.au> wrote:
On 08/04/11 10:27, Thomas Dukleth wrote: (snip)
8. SUGGESTION.
Alternating between UTC 5, 10, and 19 with occasional adjustment for seasonal changes in local time seems to me best for encouraging diverse participation based on my trivial analysis. (snip)
Currently UTC 19 is 5am in Eastern Australia. But as we generally don't achieve large participation by Australians in these meetings (surprising in some ways) and it can't be 9am everywhere at once, we can live with this. The other two times work well for us.
There is a rapidly expanding Koha community in India and Pakistan, which iirc are 4 to 5 hours behind us - so UTC 19 is in the wee hours there. People in that zone may wish to chip in.
Good analysis, Thomas, thanks.
Bob Birchall CALYX
For India UTC 5 and 10 both are good. And at a pinch we can make it for UTC 19 too. So I think its good.. Regards, Koustubha Kale Anant Corporation Contact Details : Address : 103, Armaan Residency, R. W Sawant Road, Nr. Golden Dyes Naka, Thane (w), Maharashtra, India, Pin : 400601. TeleFax : +91-22-21720108, +91-22-21720109 Mobile : +919820715876 Website : http://www.anantcorp.com Blog : http://www.anantcorp.com/blog/?author=2
participants (6)
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Bob Birchall -
Fernando Canizo -
hansbkk@gmail.com -
Koustubha Kale -
MJ Ray -
Thomas Dukleth